Need help with car deal

[Coyote Chris]

I sent them an email asking them to explain the $3,000 "trade payoff". So what excuse did they give for the trade payoff line on your purchase.

They said I made a "good catch" and they would have caught it during the actual deal. They said the $2200 discount was only good the day they spent 2 hours talking to me but accepted it three days later, even though it was gone from their website on all the cars on the lot by Friday. They tried everything to get me to agree to the deal the day I took my "$50 visa card for a test drive. " I told them I had to think about it....frosty talked me into it. I was fully prepared to walk if they didnt take the deal on Friday. I am not excited about the car...its a nice car though....and its a safe car with a warrenty and you get loaner cars and road side assistance, which I already have. Sorry Frosty, no Thelma and Louise yet.....
The only thing I really dont like about the car other than the learning curve of all the electronics is the keyless FOBs. There are two and only two. So if you drive to Oshkosh wisconsin, you have to take the second FOB, put it into a Faraday bag, and hide it inside the car. Then, if you loose your key fob in a porta potty, there is a secret button where you enter a secret code like a telegraph key and that will get you into the car. If you have a cell phone , cell phone coverage and the app, you can open the car door and even start the engine, but the car aint gonna move without a key FOB....hence the one in the "trunk" or ? in a Faraday bag. Or you buy a new third FOB for $500. NO Valet key.

 

[Coyote Chris]

Just a reminder.... be SURE to wear your tin foil hat at ALL TIMES while driving the new Subie...... can't be too careful, I always say. I'm surprised that you didn't get the "cloaking" option that renders you invisible to the black helicopters that always seem to be lurking in the Pacific Northwest!
Congrats!

Mike

What I need is an anti wife option. An air"Tag". (the one I tried for me I wasnt very impressed with) My Wife drives her 2015 subaru...the one with the valet key hidden and the break in key wired somewhere...to a dog tracking field in Wenatchee, walks the dogs in this big field, and looses her car keys. She wont listen to me and take pics of where the breakin key is and valet key....but she does get a bunch of people who walk line abreast and find the big red "remove before flight" flag I have put on her key ring. She has no concept of how important a car key is 150 miles from home and its hot and you have 3 dogs. If you loose a fob on a modern car and dont have a spare or cell phone , yes, the fire dept and police have a break in kit but the car gets towed to a dealer and it sits till a new fob can get shipped to the dealer. You rent a car? One FOB. I lost my cell phone at a little gas station in Wyoming and the nice people there shipped it to me for free. I lost my wallet on the floor of the crapper at the Home Depot and luckily I saw it. Now its chained to my belt. Old age isnt for sissies.

 

[Coyote Chris]

He misunderstood. I wanted to be safe when he has to drive me to be detained at THE Old Folks Home, and I hope he has enough money left to go thru the McDonald's drive thru on the way ... dare to dream.

Just a question ... If we wanted to do a Thelma and Louise off of a cliff into a coulee, how could we disarm all of those airbags. Would the autobrake stop us before we jumped the guardrail?

With this car, you cant even hit the guard rail in reverse....auto braking.....I do like the fact that with one touch screen button, you can turn off the "autostop " at stop lights "feature. What a crock. It will be fun to see where the price goes on this car.....35k marked down to 33 k. Its a Limited which is the second from the top trim level. The top of the line Wildnerness is nice but geared way too low for towing....kiss off 3-4 mpg.

 

[junglejim]

With this car, you cant even hit the guard rail in reverse....auto braking.....I do like the fact that with one touch screen button, you can turn off the "autostop " at stop lights "feature. What a crock. It will be fun to see where the price goes on this car.....35k marked down to 33 k. Its a Limited which is the second from the top trim level. The top of the line Wildnerness is nice but geared way too low for towing....kiss off 3-4 mpg.

Congratulations on your new Subie. I understand what you mean by steep learning curve. I bought the last available 2024 Forester and I’m glad I did. Last 2 tanks of gas I hit 40 mpg. Normally it is 36 mpg but dropped to 30 in mid winter.

My big disappointment is the tires. Poor winter traction and 2 flats so far from sharp gravel. They are very thin with little tread. I advise avoiding gravel roads. And I have arguments with the car on who is controlling the lights - me or the car. I turn lights on and off as needed and then the car changes to whatever. And my small utility trailer blows the 5 amp fuse on t trailer wire harness (the secret fuse that isn’t shown in the owners manual). But overall it’s better than my wife’s Honda CRV. - - - so far

 

[Coyote Chris]

Congratulations on your new Subie. I understand what you mean by steep learning curve. I bought the last available 2024 Forester and I’m glad I did. Last 2 tanks of gas I hit 40 mpg. Normally it is 36 mpg but dropped to 30 in mid winter.

My big disappointment is the tires. Poor winter traction and 2 flats so far from sharp gravel. They are very thin with little tread. I advise avoiding gravel roads. And I have arguments with the car on who is controlling the lights - me or the car. I turn lights on and off as needed and then the car changes to whatever. And my small utility trailer blows the 5 amp fuse on t trailer wire harness (the secret fuse that isn’t shown in the owners manual). But overall it’s better than my wife’s Honda CRV. - - - so far

My headlights are supposed to follow the steering wheel and are LED. Havent driven at night yet. I will not sell my 2018 Forester for anything. One thing I do like about my 2025 is adjusting the adaptive cruise from the steering wheel, although I pretty much like 3 seconds. I also like the Oil temp gage.
My 8 year 80,000 mile extended warrenty on the 2018 was $800. I think that one on my 2025 is $3200. But the car is one big computer......I will have to see what tires I got...the ones on the Forester are 7 years and 30,000 mile old and are fine.
I have "Auto Android" that connects my phone to the big display but I am not quite sure it turns itself off and stops eating data....have to do some tests.
I must admit the paddle shifters are great for going down long hills and using engine breaking.

 

[junglejim]

My headlights are supposed to follow the steering wheel and are LED. Havent driven at night yet. I will not sell my 2018 Forester for anything. One thing I do like about my 2025 is adjusting the adaptive cruise from the steering wheel, although I pretty much like 3 seconds. I also like the Oil temp gage.
My 8 year 80,000 mile extended warrenty on the 2018 was $800. I think that one on my 2025 is $3200. But the car is one big computer......I will have to see what tires I got...the ones on the Forester are 7 years and 30,000 mile old and are fine.
I have "Auto Android" that connects my phone to the big display but I am not quite sure it turns itself off and stops eating data....have to do some tests.
I must admit the paddle shifters are great for going down long hills and using engine breaking.

The reactive LED headlights are nice. But I don’t like the adaptive cruise control. When I’m on a car pass passes me and pulls back into my lane my cruise slows me down so the next car is quick to pass and slow me down more and so on. It took me a month to figure out how to turn it off. Besides I rarely use the cruise anyway because I get better fuel mileage running the throttle myself.

Like most other vehicles now the Subaru doesn’t like cold weather. Instructions say don’t drive the car until the “cold temp” light goes off. The car refuses to up-shift until the engine AND transmission temperatures are up. Until those temperatures are up I try to keep the RPMs under 2000 but that only lets me go about 25 mph. So on a cold day I’ll let the car warm up for a few minutes, but it takes several miles of driving before the transmission temperature will allow upshifting.

I still don’t know how to turn the radio off. Sure, there is a knob which I turn off when parking the car, but on start up the radio is back on without turning the knob. Besides that sometimes it’s playing music from my cellphone which is in my pocket and locked and sometimes it plays the radio. I guess the car is smart enough to decide what music WE should hear. Yes, the phone is paired with the car but I usually leave that disconnected because I rarely use the phone while driving.

I find that using the touch screen is distracting while driving but necessary at times for navigation and heater/defroster control etc. I often have to wait for the right moment to take my eyes off the road long enough to manipulate the touch screen.

The problem is “new car - old driver”.

 

[suvcw04]

Try pushing "in" on the volume knob. My Maverick radio shuts of completely that way.

 

[Randall-in-Mpls]

My big disappointment is the tires. Poor winter traction and 2 flats so far from sharp gravel.

A couple years before trading it in, I put Falken Wildpeak A/T tires on my Baja. I loved them. It was a completely different car.
I could even pull other cars out of the snow. Never had the traction to do that before.

 

[mikesim]

The reactive LED headlights are nice. But I don’t like the adaptive cruise control. When I’m on a car pass passes me and pulls back into my lane my cruise slows me down so the next car is quick to pass and slow me down more and so on. It took me a month to figure out how to turn it off. Besides I rarely use the cruise anyway because I get better fuel mileage running the throttle myself.

Like most other vehicles now the Subaru doesn’t like cold weather. Instructions say don’t drive the car until the “cold temp” light goes off. The car refuses to up-shift until the engine AND transmission temperatures are up. Until those temperatures are up I try to keep the RPMs under 2000 but that only lets me go about 25 mph. So on a cold day I’ll let the car warm up for a few minutes, but it takes several miles of driving before the transmission temperature will allow upshifting.

I still don’t know how to turn the radio off. Sure, there is a knob which I turn off when parking the car, but on start up the radio is back on without turning the knob. Besides that sometimes it’s playing music from my cellphone which is in my pocket and locked and sometimes it plays the radio. I guess the car is smart enough to decide what music WE should hear. Yes, the phone is paired with the car but I usually leave that disconnected because I rarely use the phone while driving.

I find that using the touch screen is distracting while driving but necessary at times for navigation and heater/defroster control etc. I often have to wait for the right moment to take my eyes off the road long enough to manipulate the touch screen.

The problem is “new car - old driver”.

Actually, your Subie doesn't mind the cold at all. That instruction and cold temp lamp are there at the behest of your dear Uncle (Sam). The reason for the delayed upshift is to get the cat converter warmed up quickly to the "light off" point. The light off point is the internal temperature at which the cat becomes effective at cleaning up the emissions. You won't hurt the car by driving off as you always have but you may be polluting the air a tad, but don't worry, my lips are sealed.

Mike

 

[Coyote Chris]

The reactive LED headlights are nice. But I don’t like the adaptive cruise control. When I’m on a car pass passes me and pulls back into my lane my cruise slows me down so the next car is quick to pass and slow me down more and so on. It took me a month to figure out how to turn it off. Besides I rarely use the cruise anyway because I get better fuel mileage running the throttle myself.

Like most other vehicles now the Subaru doesn’t like cold weather. Instructions say don’t drive the car until the “cold temp” light goes off. The car refuses to up-shift until the engine AND transmission temperatures are up. Until those temperatures are up I try to keep the RPMs under 2000 but that only lets me go about 25 mph. So on a cold day I’ll let the car warm up for a few minutes, but it takes several miles of driving before the transmission temperature will allow upshifting.

I still don’t know how to turn the radio off. Sure, there is a knob which I turn off when parking the car, but on start up the radio is back on without turning the knob. Besides that sometimes it’s playing music from my cellphone which is in my pocket and locked and sometimes it plays the radio. I guess the car is smart enough to decide what music WE should hear. Yes, the phone is paired with the car but I usually leave that disconnected because I rarely use the phone while driving.

I find that using the touch screen is distracting while driving but necessary at times for navigation and heater/defroster control etc. I often have to wait for the right moment to take my eyes off the road long enough to manipulate the touch screen.

The problem is “new car - old driver”.

I was trying to turn the radio off today....couldnt figure it out so I just turned the vol down. LOL! I agree with you about the touch screen. And environmental controls.
My book says nothing about waiting for the cold temp light to go out and it drives fine cold or hot. The stupid engine stop "feature" wont work until the engine is warm, thank God. Takes about 2 miles at 45 mph actually. I just push the disable button. Interesting to see how the 8 speed tranny works...if you shift it into manual you can see what gear it is in. They are actually fake shifting points but they work fine for me..... and you can activate the paddles for instant access to manual mode and it will go back after a few seconds to using its own computer.....
I love the adaptive cruise....if someone pulls in front of me, the car just slows to match their speed....and you can pass or not. Great for semi urban traffic. One thing I dont like is the niffty multi colored MPG average screen with a pipper to show the instantanious MPG is gone. That has been replace in 2025 with a black and white tiny screen. And the info sucks.....
Once coming home from Oshkosh I was on a two lane road for 100 miles in WI and I was showing an honest 40 mpg at 55 mph. I stopped the car and felt for wind, but there wasnt any. Should have been 35 normally.

 

[Coyote Chris]

There is yet another disappointment in our wonderful world of car buying. New cars are full of complex computers working lots of complex systems....In 2018, I got a new Forester. An 8 year /80k mile maintenance contract that covers 99 percent of that could be had by shopping around various Subaru dealers around the country for $800. Mine is still in effect and if I sell the car, it is transferable and I can cancel it at any time for a pro-rated refund. (My dealer wanted 30 percent more than that minimum) Now the same coverage at my dealer is $3680. But it seems to the subaru forum that dealers were told to not undercut each other.....so I am still checking into that. $1200 of that is pure profit...like the paperwork fees. The 5 year power train warrenty only covers pieces that are in direct contact with lubrication fluid.

 

[junglejim]

Try pushing "in" on the volume knob. My Maverick radio shuts of completely that way.

Nope, pushing knob in only turns radio off until the next start up. I just wasted an hour reading the owner’s manual (volume 4) and found nothing.

But I did manage to call “Starlink Emergency Roadside” (twice) while trying to turn on my interior lights to look for the owner’s mail.

Later
I found it!!!! Chapter 5 in the owner’s manual referred me to chapter 6 in a different manual. That says “press to mute and press a h hold to turn off”
New cars are incompatible with old drivers.

 

[ST1100Y]

New cars are incompatible with old drivers.

Even pros have their trouble...
Observed the owner/master of my Toyota workshop arriving with a current Corolla Hybrid this week: he stopped, rolled the gate open, got back in the vehicle... and stalled it 3 times...

It just won't release that automatically engaged electric parking brake until the driver is buckled up...!
Must be a nightmare for the blokes having to move them around in the shop and on the lot...
How stupid do the designers think that people are to incapacitate them like this...

BTW pressing knobs:
While my trusty '96 Toyota Carina estate was in for service, I got a Yaris XP9 as loaner... (what a tiny 'pothole filling'... life as an insect and such... )
Bloody thing wouldn't let me change the radio station! Drove me nuts...
By coincidence I found out that if you depress the volume knob in (clicks in/out like a ball-pen), it frees the [seek] function... pfffff...

 

[mikesim]

Yup! The new cars are a challenge for us olde fartze. We are still learning about our '16 Outback. It has all the bells and whistles but realistically we only use a fraction of the features that it offers. I read thru all the manuals and decided that it wasn't worth the time to try to master each bell and whistle, I no longer have the patience for such nonsense. The manuals remind me of the Bibles placed in the motel rooms by the Gideons. At least there are still manuals to read rather than a CD/DVD. My '18 Mazda CX-5 also is a technological whiz but is a tad more intuitive than the Subie. Maybe I'm just more accustomed to the Mazda since I have had the Miata for several years now.

Mike

 

[ST1100Y]

 

[Coyote Chris]

Even pros have their trouble...
Observed the owner/master of my Toyota workshop arriving with a current Corolla Hybrid this week: he stopped, rolled the gate open, got back in the vehicle... and stalled it 3 times...

It just won't release that automatically engaged electric parking brake until the driver is buckled up...!
Must be a nightmare for the blokes having to move them around in the shop and on the lot...
How stupid do the designers think that people are to incapacitate them like this...

BTW pressing knobs:
While my trusty '96 Toyota Carina estate was in for service, I got a Yaris XP9 as loaner... (what a tiny 'pothole filling'... life as an insect and such... )
Bloody thing wouldn't let me change the radio station! Drove me nuts...
By coincidence I found out that if you depress the volume knob in (clicks in/out like a ball-pen), it frees the [seek] function... pfffff...

LOL! ref: How stupid do the designers think that people are to incapacitate them like this...? Lawyers also make them put in the manuals "Dont drink the battery acid".
Unfortunately, frivolus law suits are the plauge of manufactures. My 2025 will let me pull up to my garage, set the electronic brake, unbuckle my belt, get out and open the garage door. Thankfully.
OTOH, many people are pretty stupid. Turn on the news and you will see people driving into deep flooded highways and people getting into 50 car chain accidents in dust storms/snow squals.

 

[Coyote Chris]

Yup! The new cars are a challenge for us olde fartze. We are still learning about our '16 Outback. It has all the bells and whistles but realistically we only use a fraction of the features that it offers. I read thru all the manuals and decided that it wasn't worth the time to try to master each bell and whistle, I no longer have the patience for such nonsense. The manuals remind me of the Bibles placed in the motel rooms by the Gideons. At least there are still manuals to read rather than a CD/DVD. My '18 Mazda CX-5 also is a technological whiz but is a tad more intuitive than the Subie. Maybe I'm just more accustomed to the Mazda since I have had the Miata for several years now.

Mike

Even my 2018 Forester is intuitive. There are real knobs and buttons for the Heating and air conditioning system where I dont have to fool around with a screen.
BTW, Subaru of America has done something to really increase dealer profit. It used to be I could easily get 1/3 off by shopping around for extended service contracts. and with all the new features, the cost of service can be very high. I have emailed SOA to see what the new restrictions on shopping around are. Everything from an electronic parking brake to an automaically unlocked gas cap door can easily break.

 

[Coyote Chris]

Actually, your Subie doesn't mind the cold at all. That instruction and cold temp lamp are there at the behest of your dear Uncle (Sam). The reason for the delayed upshift is to get the cat converter warmed up quickly to the "light off" point. The light off point is the internal temperature at which the cat becomes effective at cleaning up the emissions. You won't hurt the car by driving off as you always have but you may be polluting the air a tad, but don't worry, my lips are sealed.

Mike

Very interesting....in 2018 when I was car shopping, the Subaru dealer let me drive the turbo version. He said the cold lite was there so you knew the turbo wouldnt engage until the engine was warm. I will have to check the shift points cold and hot on my Crosstrek but it seems to drive well (I am not a lead foot in a car) when it is cold.

There is an update on the new Subaru externded warrenty shopping saga. I have been working with forum folk on how they get the cost of extended warrenties down to reasonable levels. As of about 8 months ago, my usual suspect dealers in CT and Maine and Penn. have stopped selling these at deep discount to people "out of their area" So I emailed Subaru and asked them what the new rules were....I wasnt going to pay $3490 for a 7 year/70,000 mi. one.

OK, done deal. I sent SOA a very nice email explaining that we love Subaru have owned 5 Subies since 1996 and have 3 this time. I asked them if their rules for shopping around for extended warrenties have changed and if so, what are the new rules? (they have you give your vin in the contact info.) So my dealer business manager calls me up and says HIS boss was called by SOA and how did I feel about paying $2500 no tax for a 7 year /70,000 Gold Plus instead of the $3490 they quoted me? I said fine. (I personally don't think at 76 years old riding 140 mph motorcycles and just being old I am gonna live that long but my child bride can always sell the car and get a refund. This was the third time SOA has been kind to us. When my wife's 2004 standard tranny outback had a bad bearing in the tranny at 65,000...inside the time limit but outside the milage, they paid half the bill. When I pointed out to SOA as sort of an FYI that a Subaru dealer was installing aftermarket oil filters, they gave me $600 in service credit....handy when my wife's 2015 Forester lunched the CVT valve body out of warrenty. I am happy.

 

[seagrass]

I am a moderator on the subaruoutback.org forum and it is amazing how many times Subaru “help out” owners with “out of warranty” repairs. It happens so often that some new forum members actually feel “hard done by” when Subaru of America do not help them in their particular situation.

It appears that those that have the most success are owners that have a relationship with their local dealer. The local dealer is the advocate for the owner to Subaru of America and it appears that if the dealer recommends the repair at a discounted or at no cost then Subaru of America authorises the repair.

Of course there are also many examples of Subaru helping out owners that have there vehicles serviced elsewhere.

Seagrass

 

[Coyote Chris]

I am a moderator on the subaruoutback.org forum and it is amazing how many times Subaru “help out” owners with “out of warranty” repairs. It happens so often that some new forum members actually feel “hard done by” when Subaru of America do not help them in their particular situation.

It appears that those that have the most success are owners that have a relationship with their local dealer. The local dealer is the advocate for the owner to Subaru of America and it appears that if the dealer recommends the repair at a discounted or at no cost then Subaru of America authorises the repair.

Of course there are also many examples of Subaru helping out owners that have there vehicles serviced elsewhere.

Seagrass

Interesting. We have worked with 3 local dealers....I cant remember in the case of the blown tranny bearing but i think the dealer contacted SOA. In the other cases, I did. The new Crosstrek is very complex. A computer even unlocks the gas cap lid. We have been happy with every dealer except a nation wide subaru dealer who called us in for a pax seat connector recall. The car was working perfectly but its a recall, Right? They said we needed a $1,400 seat cushion. We snapped the safety belt closed and drove away and never went back to that dealer.
Other than the oil piston ring debacle circa 2013/14, I have nothing bad to say about SOA.