Well well well

Coyote Chris

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My power company got caught with its hands in the cookie jar.


We were told to replace all our incadesent light bulbs with LED ones (not a bad idea) and we would save the earth.
Now, we are being told 4,000 data centers burning 500 megawatts each is a good idea. Our power company, Avista, tried to pull a fast one even though they are a public utility and claim transparency, and tried to get one of these turkeys through the permit procedure, using fully one half of their output. They were going to add public natural gas lines....over 100 miles of them....well, the people got wind of this and dont believe in crypto curancy and AI for anyone but science and defense. And state govt said hold on, you cant hold your legal emissions levels doing this crap....
Sudden flip flop due to public opinion.

Avista announced Friday afternoon that negotiations with a potential 500-megawatt data center customer have been “paused” to seek “broader policy and community alignment.”

The announcement follows criticism from many in the community and an ordinance under consideration by the Spokane City Council calling for a one-year moratorium on the construction of data centers to build stronger regulatory frameworks.

“We’ve heard the questions and concerns from our customers, community members and local leaders, and we take that feedback seriously,” Avista President and CEO Heather Rosentrater said in a news release. “This input has demonstrated a need for a broader coordinated planning effort, which Avista will actively participate in. As a regional energy provider, we are just one part of the project development process. We recognize that we need more time to align with our partners and communities in a way that is transparent, thoughtful and in the best long-term interest of our region.”

Avista officials said they are committed to collaborating with local leaders, regulators and community members on how large data center proposals are handled moving forward.
 
“We’ve heard the questions and concerns from our customers, community members and local leaders, and we take that feedback seriously,” Avista President and CEO Heather Rosentrater said in a news release. “This input has demonstrated a need for a broader coordinated planning effort, which Avista will actively participate in. As a regional energy provider, we are just one part of the project development process. We recognize that we need more time to align with our partners and communities in a way that is transparent, thoughtful and in the best long-term interest of our region.”
Translation: This is corporate speak for "let's put this puppy on the back burner for now until the furor subsides and then we'll come back next year and stuff it down their throats when they ain't payin' attention"

Mike
:rofl1:
 
Something with as much energy use as these data centers need to be planned/set up well in advance. You long term customers shouldn't have to pay for the new generators and all that goes with it.
There we go again, $$ and power drive nearly everything these days.

Arknt
 
Translation: This is corporate speak for "let's put this puppy on the back burner for now until the furor subsides and then we'll come back next year and stuff it down their throats when they ain't payin' attention"

Mike
:rofl1:
Well, the hate has grown so much that even after their statement , there are demos planned. Besides the energy use, and water use, they are very noisy. Good luck trying to sell your house if you have one of these things near you. We are not alone fighting these things....from Nashville east, people are fighting...
"I am from the govt and I am here to help you."
"This bag of fertilizer will cover 5,000 sq ft."
"This sleeping bag will keep you warm to minus 20"
"These data centers will not harm the environment (like wind mills and ethanol?) nor raise your utility bill."
 
Just a thought. Why can’t the huge data centers be required to utilize “sustainable” energy production such as wind and solar?
I personally dislike that method of energy production.

I have absolutely no problem with coal, natural gas or nuclear. Of course, ALL energy is derived from our sun.
 
Just a thought. Why can’t the huge data centers be required to utilize “sustainable” energy production such as wind and solar?
I personally dislike that method of energy production.

I have absolutely no problem with coal, natural gas or nuclear. Of course, ALL energy is derived from our sun.
The power sources for data centers have to be dead nuts reliable and dispatchable 24/7/365, wind and solar are neither.

Mike
 
Put the data centres underwater
  1. The water can cool them
  2. We can't see them
The US Navy is kinda, sorta gonna do that at Norfolk, VA soon. When the USS Gerald R. Ford returns to Norfolk for repairs, the Navy will attach jumper cables (more or less) to the Ford and attempt to power the ENTIRE naval base from the Ford's reactors. This is to determine if that in the case of a major disabling attack or natural disaster on our major coastal installations we can keep them up and running. Remember the Fukashima tsunami that disabled all four reactors in Japan.

Mike
 
The power sources for data centers have to be dead nuts reliable and dispatchable 24/7/365, wind and solar are neither.

Mike
And you would have to have huge battery banks and a switch to connect to the grid if things went south. AND there is the question of cooling water and how do you make that sustainable. Anyone have data on the sustainability of wind power as far as cost of maintenance and return.?
 
Unless there is some sort of paradigm shift in wind and solar technology, I don't see how they can ever be reliable/dispatchable enough to backup data centers. The cooling is also a big issue that needs to be addressed. Once up and running, data centers will generate an enormous amount of "waste" heat. So far the two primary methods of cooling appear to be ground water and air to air. This is a valuable resource that we should somehow attempt to utilize.

Mike
 
Interestingly Edison pioneered the use of "waste" heat at his first cogeneration facility at the Pearl St. Station in NYC. His dynamos for generation of 100VDC were coal fired and provided lighting for about 1000 customers served by the station. Rather than allow the surplus heat go to waste, he created a steam heating district and used the surplus energy to provide steam heat to local businessesand residences. The same could be done with the waste heat from the data centers.

Mike
 
The same could be done with the waste heat from the data centers.
Only that no one wants them near populated areas, especially the residents...
(same "not in my backyard!" attitude applies for waste management facilities, wind turbines, yet even hydro-plants...)
 
There are 100 wind turbines north of town. Doesn't bother me a bit. Kind of interesting to look at. At night, their flashing aircraft warning lights are pretty.
I have looked under some of them. Not a dead bird in sight.
 
Is it possible/feasible to send the data these centers use to several different locations? That would allow each center to be smaller and not be as disruptive to the local area as far as power, water, cooling, etc. Still the same overall result, just spread out the positives and negatives a bit.

I see here locally a solar panel farm will be built soon. The power lines that it will supply were ran to it a couple weeks ago. No panels there yet, but I see them in crates in storage 1/4 mile from there. Their location won't disrupt much, it is taking over a farm pasture close to town and major electric lines, interstate 40, etc.
Not sure if they make $$ over the long haul without government subsidies. I think this was planned quite a while back, those crates of panels have been stored there for a year or two.

Arknt
 
Does solar work? Ask Germany.
Does wind power work? Iowa receives over 63% of our electricity from wind.
We even export it to Wisconsin and Minnesota.
 
Does solar work? Ask Germany.
Does wind power work? Iowa receives over 63% of our electricity from wind.
They all work, and they are all important sources of energy, but are they there when you need it? It's like the old saying about the reason one should consider arming ones home for safety...... "when seconds count, the police are only minutes away.....""

Mike
 
Out-of-State Transmission
  • Regional Grid Markets: Wind farms in Iowa feed into the Midcontinent Independent System Operator (MISO) and Southwest Power Pool wholesale power markets. [1, 2]
  • Export Destinations: Through these interconnected, high-voltage transmission lines, Iowa's surplus wind energy travels to neighboring states, including Illinois, Minnesota, Missouri, and Wisconsin.
 
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